FORUMS


The grind, gating the full experience, and humane/sensible player retention



Posted: //
April 12, 2018, 4:55 p.m.


Updated //
April 12, 2018, 5:07 p.m.

LYB-FooJub#4039 posted (#post-217571) said:

You're a bit deluded if you think the game is pay to win. Pay to progress does exist in DN, but it isn't "killing player retention". The amount of money required to progress substantially is in itself a substantial amount, so very few actually do that.

So the goal of the company is to convince people to pay for something. If, when confronted with this reality, players are choosing to A ) not pay or B ) leave the game, those are not outcomes that the company wants, and if the majority of their potential players are choosing either of those two then their design is hurting them. The prior option at least gives them the opportunity to make a sale later, and it's why one of the primary goals of this progression system, besides incentivising an elite purchase or hero ship purchase, is to keep players playing by dangling what they want just out of reach. However, when what they want is the core depth of the game, that can and will turn off players who might otherwise remain active members of the game long enough to become personally invested and actually contribute $ to the game (via purchases). It doesn't matter how sweet your goals looks, if a player isn't having fun anymore and the goal is too far away, they're just going to stop playing.

LYB-FooJub#4039 posted (#post-217571) said:

If it takes A YEAR to grind ANY ship in this game, even the dola, from t4 to t5, you're not playing the game, or you are playing as well as a hamster on drugs. Heck even a hamster on drugs queuing up and hopping on the keyboard could do better than that. Elite/xp conversion are not that big of a deal as you make it out to be. In the end it still comes down to how you are as a player. I haven't bought elite, excluding when I bought the founders pack. I have 9 t5 ships (haven't played in 2-3 months) and have a surplus of 2.6 mil exp on my vindi, and 800k on my valcour. The only significant means to boost progress assuming you play decently is buying credits, as there is a huge divide between exp and credits gained. But again. Ship's only as good as the captain.

Sure, but tell me: how many hours have you logged playing to get there?


Posted: //
April 12, 2018, 5:07 p.m.



I am best at grinding when I am feeling bad. Arm broken? Tier 5 unlocked! Catched a flu? 17/17 mods researched!

It is poor that Dreadnought creates such a hopeless feeling when grinding. I am feeling so demoralized, that I need to suffer from real pain first, to grind stuff. Because then I am experiencing hope, that through the long grind I will recover, getting well.

Give us a not so horrendous grind, give us hope.


The community should not be afraid of the developers- The developers should be afraid of their community. carrier

^I want to believe^

https://youtu.be/z_Gd9-IfYzw


Posted: //
April 12, 2018, 5:09 p.m.



Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-217575) said:

LYB-FooJub#4039 posted (#post-217573) said:

Except even now, there are people who are in tiers they don't belong in. Recruit, vet and legendary aren't just t classify ships, they're to classify players. Making the grind EVEN EASIER than it already is will simply result in even more frustration and less player retention as people with little to no experience rush headlong into players with months of experience.

No. Just no. A league system classifies players. Not this broken system.

Bingo! Part of the problem is trying to use this 1 system as a solution to two disparate and complicated problems. BB and I may not see eye to eye on the grind, but we're on the same page here for sure!


Posted: //
April 12, 2018, 5:11 p.m.



Enterprise_NC1701#2026 posted (#post-217578) said:

I am best at grinding when I am feeling bad. Arm broken? Tier 5 unlocked! Catched a flu? 17/17 mods researched!

It is poor that Dreadnought creates such a hopeless feeling when grinding. I am feeling so demoralized, that I need to suffer from real pain first, to grind stuff. Because then I am experiencing hope, that through the long grind I will recover, getting well.

Give us a not so horrendous grind, give us hope.

I can't help but wonder if some of the calculus involved in that is that when your alternative choices of how to spend your time are reduced is the only reason you're choosing to spend so much time playing Dreadnought, instead of you willingly giving more time to play when you're not unable to do other things? Maybe I'm reading too much into that though...


Posted: //
April 12, 2018, 5:40 p.m.



Not really...

I am only willing to "hardcore" grind if there aren't any other options.


The community should not be afraid of the developers- The developers should be afraid of their community. carrier

^I want to believe^

https://youtu.be/z_Gd9-IfYzw


Posted: //
April 12, 2018, 6:04 p.m.



Enterprise_NC1701#2026 posted (#post-217584) said:

Not really...

I am only willing to "hardcore" grind if there aren't any other options.

Yeah, see that's not healthy for a game that wants you to be playing it as a lifestyle, not out of necessity. D-:


Posted: //
April 13, 2018, 7:15 p.m.



One of those problems is, that not only your skill matters. You could have the biggest gun, but what does it matter if it does not have bullets? What I am trying to say: You need a build you are feeling comfortable with, a build that is fun to play. The problem is the grind towards this build. That is the worst part. After you got your build, the grind will hurt a bit less, but it is still enormous.


The community should not be afraid of the developers- The developers should be afraid of their community. carrier

^I want to believe^

https://youtu.be/z_Gd9-IfYzw


Posted: //
April 14, 2018, 1:44 p.m.


Updated //
April 14, 2018, 2:02 p.m.

https://imgur.com/a/RDp5Z

@JinxedJoker 114.8 hours since the last and final reset. Or, less than 5 days. 1/61, for multiple t5 (and 4) ships. Not just a jutland.


Posted: //
April 14, 2018, 2:52 p.m.



I've played for 170 ish hours played, all T4's unlocked and most geared, with 3 T5's. and to be fair, I didnt start playing Veteran until the Battle Bonus system was implomented, so a good chunk of that time was in recruit matches. I started playing last May, so almost a year.


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Posted: //
April 21, 2018, 10:16 p.m.



I just started on tier3 and i have to say i was a bit shocked by the climb in xp needed for research. I'm into the game now, but its only a matter of time before the same matches get old and I'm progessing at a sluggish pace. The game is so geared toward making you pay, it makes people not want to pay and worse not play. Theres a lot to love about this game, but the grind with each new tier is just sucks fun from it.


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