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"Fixing" EM on Arty Cruisers, Choices and Cooldowns.



Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 6:52 a.m.



If you want to sit in front of an art at 4K and get shot by the main gun that's a L2P issue not a module is op/broken. Positioning it part of the game. You can't expect to face tank an arts main gun.


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Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 7:30 a.m.



Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-221863) said:

If you want to sit in front of an art at 4K and get shot by the main gun that's a L2P issue not a module is op/broken. Positioning it part of the game. You can't expect to face tank an arts main gun.

Could not have said it better myself!


Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 8:47 a.m.



(and the Rational / Litterate groups roll their eyes again,...... lolz)

The post is not about being shot [ BY ] Arty Cruisers, LmF.Aoff . . . .

It states as it shows: Shooting At 'Medium' Arty Cruisers (or heavyies maybe) at 4.5km

And how long it takes for shots to travel being such that EM has cooled down for another use esp if using Retaliator it would seem. (being at the lip of an edge to avoid return fire, eh)

But again one's that cannot see what I have posted likely are "Those Kinds" of players, eh? And so would just assume the same from the rest of us.... XD

(lol, sorta jk) Though to be fair such posts do have to make the rest of "us" wonder...

and again, The Thread / Post is about ways how EM might be addressed as a whole. meh, (reading)

Nose On vs incoming fire, they with shot dispersions + EM can just sit in one place never moving yet never die... lol, but hey. Makes em easier from the sides when they then have to actually Think or React, eh?


"Glory to the Truth, amen." (>_< '7


Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 8:56 a.m.



Again, EM is an amazing 'MOVEMENT' utility, to be sure.

The Issue being again when a Murometz can sit simply looking at you unmoving 4.5km away from a ship with 7km ranged main guns, never taking damage to speak of with Tac Support if ever is, being ignored by Blues and not taking hits just as they start to reach them... Never Moving or Otherwise but not taking hits.

The Idea in Question being How can we help "Fix" EM to serve its proper role as a Movement Utility, while also not being a tad annoyingly game breaking if no one is helping out?

(for one thought perhaps.....)

Have it be one where you press to activate as would other things like Lazers or Autoguns, that have a duration.

Turn it "On," and move in the direction last pushed OR is being held in when activated, moving at a steady pace for 2 to 4 seconds worth an ok distance. During such time one cannot rotate quickly but can turn it 'off' at any time.

To move a decent way in 2 seconds of time then sit there for an average 6 seconds timer following a 2 to 4 seconds of "up time and cooldown", One could get around fine enough but NOT be impossible to hit by skilled shooters.

(such those sorts in Arty or Tacs could still do well 'now,' so isn't really a big breaker) Just a good to use shift.


"Glory to the Truth, amen." (>_< '7


Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 8:59 a.m.



You are the one saying there is something wrong with EM, and saying at at 4K and art can kill you thanks to EM. We are saying why EM is fine and not broken, yet you keep going over the samething using the same argument when the "problem" you have with EM is your perception of how it should work because you think it should because you get killed by arts using it when your 4K away from them.

The module is not broke. Its like saying Dreadnoughts are OP because I can't out tank one in a light corvette. It's Just silly.


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Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 9:05 a.m.



It's balanced, there is no need to change anything in regards to this post.

The Blud is one of my most favorite destroyers if not the most favorite. I know it shoots slow, so I simply account for it. I use other tactics, such as warping through obticles so I am on top of my target. That counters the slow speed my projectiles move at. Also module weapons, when I am nice and close, and have surprised my target I can tank the damage and dish it out.

I also love flying arties, and I know my tank is paper thin, and that I must take that into account before placing myself on the field. I also know that I need to keep moving, so I don't present a target that someone can easily get behind, and blow me away. Peek above obsticles so that it's more difficult to hit me, and I can easily drop under cover.

It's all trade offs, for long distance shots with hard hitting DPS, you sacrafice tank. For more tank you sacrafice, in the case of the Blud, how fast your projectile moves. My Vindicta can shoot fast and track fast so it's easier to take out vets, but again I sacrafice the distance my projectiles travel, and tank, Vindicta cannot tank like a Blud, at all. So in a Vindicta, I have to get within 5km, I need to be stealthy, sneaky, choose targets that cannot easily take me out.

This is how balancing is done. Your posts relate to trying to make certain ships more powerful in some way. Or make others less powerful. What I think most people do not want, is OP ships or fits that cause others to leave the game because it feels unfair, or whatever. Your post really amounts to claiming something is broken, or something needs to be better, and posting in this way so that you might realize the changes you want, instead of using good solid tactics for that particular ship.

I believe that is how Belial meant what he said. Instead of using "in your face" tactics, use real solid tactics. L2P means "Learn to Play" which also means use good tactics. We are suppose to be using different tactics with different ships and fits to overcome the other team. This is also the very reason why we can have two totally different fits on the same ship, and choose between those fits whenever we are able to choose to, like at the start, or when we get killed.


Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 9:12 a.m.



And "I" / We are saying, The Post is about SHOOTING AT arty cruisers of only a short range as 4.5km to 5km away, Nose On, not ever being able really to be hit.

As good a shot as I am and maybe a few others, no matter how good "We" are that are DOING the shooting, the One being Shot At [the arty] can just jerk-yank side to side every 2 to 4 seconds, never being hit, from ships with guns built to hit things up to 7km away........ with no time "when off" to counter Retaliator as we get from some things while 'active.'

If it had a 2 seconds or so "Down Time" after being used, then the 4 seconds of "CD," who knows. But yeah, read what the fking thread is about. Thanks? yeah....

Thanks for posting as according to The Topic Of the Post / Thread: When Shooting {At} and Arty ship of Medium or Heavy Size at a close range.

Thank you.

Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-221878) said:

You are the one saying there is something wrong with EM, and saying at at 4K and art can kill you thanks to EM. We are saying why EM is fine and not broken, yet you keep going over the samething using the same argument when the "problem" you have with EM is your perception of how it should work because you think it should because you get killed by arts using it when your 4K away from them.

The module is not broke. Its like saying Dreadnoughts are OP because I can't out tank one in a light corvette. It's Just silly.

(getting "shot at" was never a matter in nor of the thread posted. but we get it. reading is hard while trolling and assuming is easy)

At this point we all know and agree that I am right in what I am posting or saying per the facts, with judgments to be made by those who can read.

  • such again, at no place is the thread talk about or state anything about being shot {at or by} artilery aside from how cover is good to use.

/)'glhf

And that the Post is to ask ways in which EM can be adressed rather than being removed completely as basically happened with AS.


"Glory to the Truth, amen." (>_< '7


Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 9:39 a.m.


Updated //
June 2, 2018, 9:43 a.m.

AS is effective, learn how to use it.

You cannot drive straight head on into an artie, and expect not to get hit.

You cannot hang yourself out in the wind in an artie, and expect not to get killed relatively easy.

You cannot be 4km from an artie, and not expect it to dance around for you, so as not to get hit.

These things are meant to be this way, and you seek to alter them to fit your idea of how they should be played.

You seem to believe that balancing means making a module or briefing useless, if you are using AS correctly, and understanding it correctly, you can use it very effectively. Just because your OPINION, and that's all it is, an OPINION, is different does not mean you are right.

I get the feeling you die in your TAC ship more often now than you did when AS was OP. It's balanced now, learn how to use it or don't use it at all. But don't blame proper balancing for not being effective in a TAC ship.

As far as talking about being shot at or shooting? There has been a lot of discussion about exactly that in this post. In your first post you say "yet never be hit" In order to be "hit" you must be shot at. So yeah, you are talking about shooting, speed of shooting, etc etc etc.

Some pilots are so good in Arties, that they hardly get hit. They are using the tactics, mods and briefings that work best for them and dance around almost agile. Ask them how they are able to do it, and then try it yourself.

But you seem to want arties to move even further, for longer. You are positing that they should all be of equal strength, so then why have different options at all in arties? If you are impressed with how a ship works, then fly it yourself. But buffing a ship already balanced sounds like you are wanting to make it OP, not interested at all in balancing anything.

In regards to AS, it's balanced now, and you think it's useless. You want it back the way it was, which was not fair, not balanced and causing people to get so upset they left the game. Yet you continue to say that it's ruined, broken, useless, etc. You are wrong in this respect, and I don't mind saying it. As a pilot that flys TAC ships, I am very happy with the changes. As a pilot that flies other ships, I am equally happen. And I do use AS on my TAC fits, with the exception of the Harwitch that I use for specific purposes.

Can you hit Vets that are 4km away? Or a Vindicta pilot that is good? Or how about a TAC ship, like a Harwich, I regularly avoid people very close, without getting hit, dancing in front of ships that have a slow tracking speed, or shoot really slow. Do you want to make those ships easier to hit at 4km?


Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 9:40 a.m.



DreadgeNought#5815 posted (#post-221881) said:

And "I" / We are saying, The Post is about SHOOTING AT arty cruisers of only a short range as 4.5km to 5km away, Nose On, not ever being able really to be hit.

L2P issue. again possitoning

As good a shot as I am and maybe a few others, no matter how good "We" are that are DOING the shooting, the One being Shot At [the arty] can just jerk-yank side to side every 2 to 4 seconds, never being hit, from ships with guns built to hit things up to 7km away........ with no time "when off" to counter Retaliator as we get from some things while 'active.'

Again, you have modules to stop it, use them.

If it had a 2 seconds or so "Down Time" after being used, then the 4 seconds of "CD," who knows. But yeah, read what the fking thread is about. Thanks? yeah....

Thanks for posting as according to The Topic Of the Post / Thread: When Shooting {At} and Arty ship of Medium or Heavy Size at a close range.

Thank you.

Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-221878) said:

You are the one saying there is something wrong with EM, and saying at at 4K and art can kill you thanks to EM. We are saying why EM is fine and not broken, yet you keep going over the samething using the same argument when the "problem" you have with EM is your perception of how it should work because you think it should because you get killed by arts using it when your 4K away from them.

The module is not broke. Its like saying Dreadnoughts are OP because I can't out tank one in a light corvette. It's Just silly.

(getting "shot at" was never a matter in nor of the thread posted. but we get it. reading is hard while trolling and assuming is easy)

Not trolling, just half you post makes no sence, or is worded badly.

At this point we all know and agree that I am right in what I am posting or saying per the facts, with judgments to be made by those who can read.

Nope, Opinion only, you say there is something wrong with EM, and you are the only one saying it.

  • such again, at no place is the thread talk about or state anything about being shot {at or by} artilery aside from how cover is good to use.

/)'glhf

And that the Post is to ask ways in which EM can be adressed rather than being removed completely as basically happened with AS.

Again, no one other than you seems to have a problem with EM.


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Posted: //
June 2, 2018, 10:13 a.m.



Honestly it sounds like a personal problem not being able to hit an Arty Cruiser at 4k away, there maximum range is 7km and most ship weapons can easily hit 4k no problem. Have you tried using a different loadout or ship class?


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