FORUMS


The leavers



Posted: //
July 4, 2018, 11:38 a.m.


Updated //
July 4, 2018, 11:43 a.m.

Correction to my above post: this happened five times in the last day. I played four matches this morning, only one was close. This MM is ridiculous and theres no reason for it to be this bad. I had one enjoyable match out of four. One. Pathetic.

Yes, Im angry right now.



Posted: //
July 4, 2018, 4:16 p.m.



Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-223035) said:

Insidious_Wheat#1950 posted (#post-223033) said:

You see this is why the game population is so very low and why match making is absolutely vital to the health of THIS game. I am not here for any of you, don’t know any of you and don’t really want to know any of you. I have a few hour a week that I can sit and play a game to relax after all my travels. I have enough time to spend leveling up a few ships but apparently not enough time to level them all up and unlock all the mods I need to be viable most matches. So to enjoy my self I need to play with those similar types of folks so its entertainment not only for them but for my self as well.

When I get in to a match that clearly I don’t belong in because I don’t have the ships for that current match up or unlocked enough mods to at least be viable.. My limited game time is important to me, I’m sure you all could care less about that and I don’t expect any of you to care about my game time so I sort of have to take matters in to my own hands and in this case if a match is going really bad I am better off looking for a new match and hopping it will be with similar players. I don’t care about winning or loosing but love those fights where it comes down to the wire. Here is an example, I get in a match with a bunch of corvettes and they are chain scrambling everyone, just as soon as I spawn in I’m blinded until killed adn this was repeated through the whole match. Not one person on our team could get a kill only the other team scored. Why I stuck around for all that I really don’t know and should have just left.. by the way my team already started with two AI units while the other was a full team. At the end the other team was laughing about what a slaughter it was… oh yea fun times eh?

So when match making has a limited effort put in to it by developers you really cant expect the players to take it as seriously as you may want them to. Sure I would rather stay in the whole match because that means I was enjoying my self and the game play but if it’s a bad match up I will leave and look for a match that is more entertaining for me because in the end that’s all I am here for… to be entertained and if entertained enough Ill spend money to support it. Try to punish me and others?? You will only diminish an already limited player pool and discourage any new players who manage to stumble on to this game.

The key is to have match making put players or help players find environtments they find entertaining.

No MM can not account for a persons personal idea of fair or fun. Both are abstract concepts that mean different things to different people.

there are different enviroments in this game already, we have 3 divisions, and proving grounds, if you are finding matches not to your liking, maybe stick to proving grounds that way, you can have fun by your self, and not have an affect on anyone elses fun.

Again you either miss the point or are avoiding it and I don’t say this trying to be rude or disrespectful. Its about entertainment and yes that is in the eye of the beholder and you and I would have something to agree on. This original post was about punishing players who leave during a match, I was only attempting to explain why punishing players for doing that will only hurt a hurting game.

There are players who find Dreadnoughts the only entertaining play style for them and if these ships can not be viable (not perfect) but viable in all situations then players will either quit out or leave for good. Believe it or not playing games is mostly about feel and entertainment, most people don’t give a rats about how many kills they get or how many points they scored and the people that do… well they are the minority of the gaming community, often the most vocal but when it comes to revenue that supports a game and keeps it going the casual gamer is where the money is.

I have been gaming when the very first Doom was released on a 486 DX66 computer and recall when MechWarrior was one of the first player VS player games (PC) and when meridian 59 was one of the first play vs player MMOs released (really showing my age now). Point I want to make here is I have read so many studies over the years because they are very interesting to read and shed lots of light on why games like Dreadnought will never be a mainstream game and will always suffer from low population. So many games released in to the market should have been blow out successes but are not or died rather quickly because the developers I think are just more focused on releasing something and Dreadnought fits right there.

You say there are different environments already in this game, and your little shot at telling me to stick to the proving grounds so I can have fun by my self… in the end tells me you really don’t understand. I hope you will decide to not dig in your heels so much and start looking for those studies on games, gamers, the communities and what makes them work and why others fail (Im not talking about youtube feed back I mean reall multi year studies). I have seen where you try to be helpful in other posts and thats great becuase I think its a dieing thing but what I don’t think you see is how you attempt to force others to your play style, this is not an insult and hopefully you wont take it that way.

There is a reason why customers complain (you can always find the exception to the rule) but when a company listens to the customer base and addresses it and conforms to what a MAJORITY of the customers wants the business becomes successful and will even become a model for others. Most of your responses would force Customers (gamers) to conform to you not the majority thus Dreadnought must use AI to fill player spots.


Posted: //
July 4, 2018, 4:43 p.m.



TBH, I'm starting to think of just starting to leave when I see light destroyers with ram. I'm ok with it being powerful, I'm ok with it being amplifiable, but it being the only attack that goes flat out ignores shields is just plain broken as far as I'm concerned.

And I'm starting to feel like the task of making the game fun for everyone should be the devs', not mine.


Posted: //
July 5, 2018, 3:16 a.m.



Insidious_Wheat#1950 posted (#post-223061) said:

Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-223035) said:

Insidious_Wheat#1950 posted (#post-223033) said:

You see this is why the game population is so very low and why match making is absolutely vital to the health of THIS game. I am not here for any of you, don’t know any of you and don’t really want to know any of you. I have a few hour a week that I can sit and play a game to relax after all my travels. I have enough time to spend leveling up a few ships but apparently not enough time to level them all up and unlock all the mods I need to be viable most matches. So to enjoy my self I need to play with those similar types of folks so its entertainment not only for them but for my self as well.

When I get in to a match that clearly I don’t belong in because I don’t have the ships for that current match up or unlocked enough mods to at least be viable.. My limited game time is important to me, I’m sure you all could care less about that and I don’t expect any of you to care about my game time so I sort of have to take matters in to my own hands and in this case if a match is going really bad I am better off looking for a new match and hopping it will be with similar players. I don’t care about winning or loosing but love those fights where it comes down to the wire. Here is an example, I get in a match with a bunch of corvettes and they are chain scrambling everyone, just as soon as I spawn in I’m blinded until killed adn this was repeated through the whole match. Not one person on our team could get a kill only the other team scored. Why I stuck around for all that I really don’t know and should have just left.. by the way my team already started with two AI units while the other was a full team. At the end the other team was laughing about what a slaughter it was… oh yea fun times eh?

So when match making has a limited effort put in to it by developers you really cant expect the players to take it as seriously as you may want them to. Sure I would rather stay in the whole match because that means I was enjoying my self and the game play but if it’s a bad match up I will leave and look for a match that is more entertaining for me because in the end that’s all I am here for… to be entertained and if entertained enough Ill spend money to support it. Try to punish me and others?? You will only diminish an already limited player pool and discourage any new players who manage to stumble on to this game.

The key is to have match making put players or help players find environtments they find entertaining.

No MM can not account for a persons personal idea of fair or fun. Both are abstract concepts that mean different things to different people.

there are different enviroments in this game already, we have 3 divisions, and proving grounds, if you are finding matches not to your liking, maybe stick to proving grounds that way, you can have fun by your self, and not have an affect on anyone elses fun.

Again you either miss the point or are avoiding it and I don’t say this trying to be rude or disrespectful. Its about entertainment and yes that is in the eye of the beholder and you and I would have something to agree on. This original post was about punishing players who leave during a match, I was only attempting to explain why punishing players for doing that will only hurt a hurting game.

There are players who find Dreadnoughts the only entertaining play style for them and if these ships can not be viable (not perfect) but viable in all situations then players will either quit out or leave for good. Believe it or not playing games is mostly about feel and entertainment, most people don’t give a rats about how many kills they get or how many points they scored and the people that do… well they are the minority of the gaming community, often the most vocal but when it comes to revenue that supports a game and keeps it going the casual gamer is where the money is.

I have been gaming when the very first Doom was released on a 486 DX66 computer and recall when MechWarrior was one of the first player VS player games (PC) and when meridian 59 was one of the first play vs player MMOs released (really showing my age now). Point I want to make here is I have read so many studies over the years because they are very interesting to read and shed lots of light on why games like Dreadnought will never be a mainstream game and will always suffer from low population. So many games released in to the market should have been blow out successes but are not or died rather quickly because the developers I think are just more focused on releasing something and Dreadnought fits right there.

You say there are different environments already in this game, and your little shot at telling me to stick to the proving grounds so I can have fun by my self… in the end tells me you really don’t understand. I hope you will decide to not dig in your heels so much and start looking for those studies on games, gamers, the communities and what makes them work and why others fail (Im not talking about youtube feed back I mean reall multi year studies). I have seen where you try to be helpful in other posts and thats great becuase I think its a dieing thing but what I don’t think you see is how you attempt to force others to your play style, this is not an insult and hopefully you wont take it that way.

There is a reason why customers complain (you can always find the exception to the rule) but when a company listens to the customer base and addresses it and conforms to what a MAJORITY of the customers wants the business becomes successful and will even become a model for others. Most of your responses would force Customers (gamers) to conform to you not the majority thus Dreadnought must use AI to fill player spots.

There are many games that punish players for leaving mid match, it's not a new concept. Guild Wars 2 is the only other game I really play at the moment, and that locks you out of a match for 3 minuets at the start, drop again 5 minuets, again 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35, 40 and so on till you hit the hour mark I believe then your locked out of PvP till the weekly reset. Granted I've never ever heard of anyone being locked out for the week, the longest I've heard of was 35, but then they had to remove the system for that week as it was down to a server issue that kept locking people in to there map and not seeing the end of match screen.

Even In that game that's years old and has a player base of hundreds of thousands of players, you still get one sided matchas, for the same reasons it happens here. People don't have the right builds, there is a skill gap, counter classes on one side and not the other and good old lack of game/map/class knowledge.

Having a lock out system will not hurt a game, it will keep people who want to play in games, and people who only want to play when they personally think something is fair.


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Posted: //
July 5, 2018, 5:52 a.m.


Updated //
July 5, 2018, 5:55 a.m.

So basically the "condom with a hole" kinda solution? You know, it gives a false sense of security while you're getting screwed?

Because I don't see anything in there that would actually deterr someone who's using it to troll. At worst you just get to troll with leaving the game a couple of times before you go play something else for half an hour, and at best you can just make a few other accounts to play in the meantime. It's not like it even costs an extra subscription fee or anything.

The only ones getting screwed by it are the ones who got a genuine bug. E.g., yesterday I had twice in a row that Ixion failed to load, and the third time my camera was fixed. And no, clicking didn't fix it. I could shoot by clicking, but only in one direction. So basically you're saying that the game should have punished me for that with a timeout, for no other reason than that the devs can't fix their cr*p.


Posted: //
July 5, 2018, 7:47 a.m.



Spurius Maximus#2411 posted (#post-223120) said:

So basically the "condom with a hole" kinda solution? You know, it gives a false sense of security while you're getting screwed?

Because I don't see anything in there that would actually deterr someone who's using it to troll. At worst you just get to troll with leaving the game a couple of times before you go play something else for half an hour, and at best you can just make a few other accounts to play in the meantime. It's not like it even costs an extra subscription fee or anything.

The only ones getting screwed by it are the ones who got a genuine bug. E.g., yesterday I had twice in a row that Ixion failed to load, and the third time my camera was fixed. And no, clicking didn't fix it. I could shoot by clicking, but only in one direction. So basically you're saying that the game should have punished me for that with a timeout, for no other reason than that the devs can't fix their cr*p.

I see your not read what i said. in this game you'd have to set the timer differently to "lock" sopmeone out of matches. Sure a Troll could make other accounts, but then doing that would take time, so they are still not playing while they are doing that, and then they would have to go through the sheltered MM first then level back up if they want to greef anyone other than recruit players, so i guess realy, your point really has not validity to it.

As for your bug comment, yeah it happens, no system is fool proof. as for your camera lock bug, zoom will allow you to move your guns, then when you die, switch load out on that ship, or select another and the bug "fixes" it's self. Next time you die, switch back to the original ship/loadout and your all good. I know it's annoying, Ive had to play whole matches with it because i didnt die.


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Posted: //
July 5, 2018, 9:16 a.m.



Spurius Maximus#2411 posted (#post-223120) said:

The only ones getting screwed by it are the ones who got a genuine bug. E.g., yesterday I had twice in a row that Ixion failed to load, and the third time my camera was fixed. And no, clicking didn't fix it. I could shoot by clicking, but only in one direction. So basically you're saying that the game should have punished me for that with a timeout, for no other reason than that the devs can't fix their cr*p.

If your camera is bugged, open and close the pause menu


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Posted: //
July 5, 2018, 9:46 a.m.



Ah. Thanks, good to know.


Posted: //
July 5, 2018, 10:24 a.m.


Updated //
July 5, 2018, 10:25 a.m.

Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-223124) said: I see your not read what i said. in this game you'd have to set the timer differently to "lock" sopmeone out of matches. Sure a Troll could make other accounts, but then doing that would take time, so they are still not playing while they are doing that, and then they would have to go through the sheltered MM first then level back up if they want to greef anyone other than recruit players, so i guess realy, your point really has not validity to it.

I find it almost a rule of thumb that when someone proclaims in advance that they won the argument, no need to wait for any discussion, anyone disagreeing just didn't read their profound wisdom... it just means they really can't make much of an argument. Be it about gameplay, Jesus, or flat Earth, the same applies. They won, you a priori have no validity, because... wishful thinking :p

ANYWAY... Making another account and getting out of protected MM takes hardly any time at all, considering that once you've made it you have it for ever. The only way for that timing to be any deterrent would be if you had to make a whole new one every time. But 1 or 2 would get you through any lock-out from here to infinity, without any need to make any more and wait any more.

Losing about a day worth of matches outside recruit to get a veteran ship or two is also hardly a deterrent, since again you keep it for ever.

And it's not just theoretical wishful thinking., I have multiple accounts in several games (mostly to get around the limited ship/character/whatever slots in those games), and I've never had to redo the account creation and newbie area all over again from scratch just because I swicthed account. Once you've got the account and got past the newbia are or MM, that's it. Any deterrent value in having more than one account simply vanishes past that point.

Plus, you seem to be assuming that the kind of person who's leaving has their life revolving around playing the upper tiers. In fact, a lot of us actually like the lower tier gameplay more. At veteran and above everything you've learned before goes out the windos, and the game increasingly becomes a fest of one-shot, two-shot, annoying or just plain old BS abilities that make it not much fun for a lot of people who aren't into exploiting the unbalance of the month themselves. There's a reason why at least half the roster in Recruit games is level 50 players.

And for someone looking to troll, trolling newbies is just as good, if not better, so that REALLY didn't solve anything.

And the ones I've seen genuinely get annoyed and leave a game (you occasionally see it even on youtube), it was again invariably about the BS gameplay at higher levels. So I'm not sure a day or two of playing recruit again would exactly be a punishment.

But let's say they don't go and play a new account in recruit, and are actually that daft and unimaginative as to actually be absolutely unable to think of any way to play while a lock down is in effect. Let's even say they take it as some sign that they MUST stay in the game. Then what do you think happens? They're still in a match they don't enjoy. Forcing someone to keep trucking through some non-fun quarter of an hour doesn't magically make it fun. Then at best you get some people who uninstall the game (and yeah, surely we need even less players) and at worst people who then alt-tab and go watch a movie instead of just quitting the round. So now you can't even have the MM shove someone else in their place for the rest of the round.


Posted: //
July 5, 2018, 12:41 p.m.



Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-223071) said:

Insidious_Wheat#1950 posted (#post-223061) said:

Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-223035) said:

Insidious_Wheat#1950 posted (#post-223033) said:

You see this is why the game population is so very low and why match making is absolutely vital to the health of THIS game. I am not here for any of you, don’t know any of you and don’t really want to know any of you. I have a few hour a week that I can sit and play a game to relax after all my travels. I have enough time to spend leveling up a few ships but apparently not enough time to level them all up and unlock all the mods I need to be viable most matches. So to enjoy my self I need to play with those similar types of folks so its entertainment not only for them but for my self as well.

When I get in to a match that clearly I don’t belong in because I don’t have the ships for that current match up or unlocked enough mods to at least be viable.. My limited game time is important to me, I’m sure you all could care less about that and I don’t expect any of you to care about my game time so I sort of have to take matters in to my own hands and in this case if a match is going really bad I am better off looking for a new match and hopping it will be with similar players. I don’t care about winning or loosing but love those fights where it comes down to the wire. Here is an example, I get in a match with a bunch of corvettes and they are chain scrambling everyone, just as soon as I spawn in I’m blinded until killed adn this was repeated through the whole match. Not one person on our team could get a kill only the other team scored. Why I stuck around for all that I really don’t know and should have just left.. by the way my team already started with two AI units while the other was a full team. At the end the other team was laughing about what a slaughter it was… oh yea fun times eh?

So when match making has a limited effort put in to it by developers you really cant expect the players to take it as seriously as you may want them to. Sure I would rather stay in the whole match because that means I was enjoying my self and the game play but if it’s a bad match up I will leave and look for a match that is more entertaining for me because in the end that’s all I am here for… to be entertained and if entertained enough Ill spend money to support it. Try to punish me and others?? You will only diminish an already limited player pool and discourage any new players who manage to stumble on to this game.

The key is to have match making put players or help players find environtments they find entertaining.

No MM can not account for a persons personal idea of fair or fun. Both are abstract concepts that mean different things to different people.

there are different enviroments in this game already, we have 3 divisions, and proving grounds, if you are finding matches not to your liking, maybe stick to proving grounds that way, you can have fun by your self, and not have an affect on anyone elses fun.

Again you either miss the point or are avoiding it and I don’t say this trying to be rude or disrespectful. Its about entertainment and yes that is in the eye of the beholder and you and I would have something to agree on. This original post was about punishing players who leave during a match, I was only attempting to explain why punishing players for doing that will only hurt a hurting game.

There are players who find Dreadnoughts the only entertaining play style for them and if these ships can not be viable (not perfect) but viable in all situations then players will either quit out or leave for good. Believe it or not playing games is mostly about feel and entertainment, most people don’t give a rats about how many kills they get or how many points they scored and the people that do… well they are the minority of the gaming community, often the most vocal but when it comes to revenue that supports a game and keeps it going the casual gamer is where the money is.

I have been gaming when the very first Doom was released on a 486 DX66 computer and recall when MechWarrior was one of the first player VS player games (PC) and when meridian 59 was one of the first play vs player MMOs released (really showing my age now). Point I want to make here is I have read so many studies over the years because they are very interesting to read and shed lots of light on why games like Dreadnought will never be a mainstream game and will always suffer from low population. So many games released in to the market should have been blow out successes but are not or died rather quickly because the developers I think are just more focused on releasing something and Dreadnought fits right there.

You say there are different environments already in this game, and your little shot at telling me to stick to the proving grounds so I can have fun by my self… in the end tells me you really don’t understand. I hope you will decide to not dig in your heels so much and start looking for those studies on games, gamers, the communities and what makes them work and why others fail (Im not talking about youtube feed back I mean reall multi year studies). I have seen where you try to be helpful in other posts and thats great becuase I think its a dieing thing but what I don’t think you see is how you attempt to force others to your play style, this is not an insult and hopefully you wont take it that way.

There is a reason why customers complain (you can always find the exception to the rule) but when a company listens to the customer base and addresses it and conforms to what a MAJORITY of the customers wants the business becomes successful and will even become a model for others. Most of your responses would force Customers (gamers) to conform to you not the majority thus Dreadnought must use AI to fill player spots.

There are many games that punish players for leaving mid match, it's not a new concept. Guild Wars 2 is the only other game I really play at the moment, and that locks you out of a match for 3 minuets at the start, drop again 5 minuets, again 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35, 40 and so on till you hit the hour mark I believe then your locked out of PvP till the weekly reset. Granted I've never ever heard of anyone being locked out for the week, the longest I've heard of was 35, but then they had to remove the system for that week as it was down to a server issue that kept locking people in to there map and not seeing the end of match screen.

Even In that game that's years old and has a player base of hundreds of thousands of players, you still get one sided matchas, for the same reasons it happens here. People don't have the right builds, there is a skill gap, counter classes on one side and not the other and good old lack of game/map/class knowledge.

Having a lock out system will not hurt a game, it will keep people who want to play in games, and people who only want to play when they personally think something is fair.

You are clinging to an old way of thinking that has had a more negative effect on the overall game, try to be innovative with solutions becuase thats when progress happens... could you imagin if the wheel was still only made of stone??

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