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Gummiel

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Anthem that is LITERALLY what obliviondoll explained why it does not work and is not a proper genre name (instead he used dota instead of AoS, so yeah substitute dota with AoS in his post and you got the counter argument fr your post already...


Basically people I have no idea what defines the different genres these days, seen lots of ppl call just about any online game for an MMO, even though there is clearly no persistence in the game


SpaceWolf#0734 posted (#post-53857)


Well I would actually love to see more ships as you stated. Right now we only have upgrades of previous ships and that's it. It would be nice if all ships would be on the same power level but different tiers of the same ship have different properties. For example speed, hull, range, maybe even different main weapons! But of course every adavantage should be compensated with drawback in another area. When I put is simple... make all ships interesting in some way! It will probably be pain to balance at first but I believe it's worth it.



Exactly the ships should pretty much be balanced in a way they were before this whole progression 2.0


And Odin the funny thing is A LOT of the complains about the new progression systems were said before it was released as well, but the devs did not seem at that point to really care enough to think too much about those complains, I dont really feel like they listening to the community AT ALL regarding progression 2.0 before it was released.


So yeah if nothing quite drastic are done about the power-tiers being straight upgrades to ships soon, I too would like to have an option to refund the founders pack as well


Imrahil#3251 posted (#post-42386)


What I don't get is this: Dreadnought is one of the rare games that is just fun to play on its own right.

The thing driving people to dreadnought is the gameplay, which is great.

The thing driving people AWAY from dreadnought is the progression, which is stupid.


Seriously, is ANYONE here doubting, that the gameplay can stand on its own two feet? This is one of the rare games that is even more fun to actually play than to watch! So for the love of god, I don't get why we need an arbitrary progression system, a method I consider obsolete and proven unsuccessfull by any game that tried using it.


Name me one single pvp game that had major success and uses a (tiered) progression system. Just one. There isn't a single one. There are however numerous games that had major success without such a system. Especially considering the initial promise of a flat progression I find this whole 2.0 business appaling.


Let's think further ahead, let's say they make it through a year with 5 tiers. What happens with the tier 5 people? They get bored and leave. Unless you invent another tier, at which point it gets even worse to balance. Tiering systems do NOT scale at all...


Please go for what is natural to dreadnought, go for the flat system, with cosmetic unlocks. Just make the smart choice, and drop in a few ships every now and then. If you hand out every fitting possible as a hero ship you'll have plenty of stuff to sell. It is deeply unnatural to the gameplay to have these arbitrary unlocks, they HURT the gameplay which is where Dreadnought shines naturally!

And the best? Going for the cosmetic and flat approach you can scale naturally. Look at what Riot is doing with League of Legends, they're doing just fine and make a ton of money. Progression? Nope. Just a simple leveling system that unlocks a few tweaks, nothing major. You can easily play without any points in any tree.


That's what I think. Stop wasting time on stuff Dreadnought sucks at, and use it on the parts where it excells!


Regards,

Imrahil



Agree with everything you said, AND to add on top of that all the different skins and looks they made for the different tiers of ships could instead be sold as cosmetics for money, I dont get it, seem to me with progression 2.0 they are basically driving away the ppl that the games seemed to be aiming for the the first place, AND limiting potential income sources as well. Seems like a loose-loose situation really

As Ropefish said yes you will be able to play right now, BUT before you buy be sure to read up on progression 2.0 as it will basically change the whole game (for many in the community to the worse from the info we have about it ATM)

Yeah same way I quite often do literally suicide warp with my athos, in that actually kill myself with my own tropedo nukes, but take at least 1, usually 2-3 enemy ships with me in the grave

While I absolutely personally would LOVE something like that, I fear it would just not be economically viable from a business standpoint really, dont think enough ppl would want to handicap themselves just to get a higher rank, when that rank doesn't actually mean anything


Devouring_One#8361 posted (#post-41321)


For an ability as damaging as assault warp, at minimum I want the option to raise my shields.


Also of note; most other modules will not one-shot you on their own. Even heavy torpedoes need a little weapons fire to guarantee a kill, but assault warp can do just just that. it is also a third offensive option that corvettes don't normally get otherwise. It is the difference between a corvette fleeing because he's got nothing left to hit you with and a corvette coming back to hit you with his other two offensive modules and full ammo clip if you somehow survived the assault warp.



Now I do agree that the shield pierce should be gone, that should not be a thing on ANY weapons/modules in the game at all, BUT first of all assault blink warp is not the only offensive module on slot 1, you got a dmg booster to weapons, which is alos offensive (even if not directly dmging in itself it does increase the dmg of your weapons thus being offensive), and in actually using an offensive module in slot 1 though does either make it a lot harder to approach without getting spotted, or get away after the payload been delivered due to lack of stealth/low cd blinks etc, ofc yes if you sitting a corner as an arty, way away from your team they will get away but frankly they could likely kill you without using any modules at all. if on the other hand you are near (if not in the middle of) your own team the chance he get away after an ABW are close to nill you if you and your team are just semi-decent, and if you sit in the corner you are far from a "great arty player"


Slimak81#0619 posted (#post-40970)


As i said i know my PC is bad. But...

It can handle any current MMO (tanks, planes, ships) game on high settings for the present time (warthunder , project Armata, world of tanks/ships/watever/

This means that something is very wrong with Dreadnough optimization. It's a pure madness creating massive online game only for I7 core users. It wont be massive =) nor online



First of none of the "World of ..." games are MMO's not even close...


2nd yes I am sure there is still bad optimization in Dreadnought, because well we are still in beta, optimization is one of the LAST things you do before release, since its a lot harder and time consuming to add/change/remove things to/from a piece of software and still keep it optimized which is done a lot during beta

Yeah only 2 contracts at a time for me


Jawayne#8001 posted (#post-40863)


Lets try something strange, be naive and believe the developers for a moment. If you watched the stream and listened to the explanation of the introduction of tiers there are two reasons why they went with this idea.


One beeing that many players stated in the surveys that they liked unlocking new ships, this may be a misunderstanding of the rather general questions and wording of those surveys. In hindsight a following focused survey to clarify this would have been better, at least considering the forum posts following the stream.



I would very much like to know how many exactly took the survey, as well as the pct. of ppl that did take it that said that



Jawayne#8001 posted (#post-40863)


The second one beeing that they could not balance the game in a way that there was meaningful horizontal progression and no power creep that would outclass new players. Matchmaking could only solve this partially, because the moment you squad up with a friend that is new to the game either you will be matched against new players or he will be matched against veteran players, both situations will annoy someone.



Or the matchmaker could try and find one player equal to your skill lvl and another equal to your friends skill lvl if possible (or alternatively 2 ppl that are in the middle of you and your friend), and that way make for more balanced team, which would make for more balanced team than this tier system could.



Jawayne#8001 posted (#post-40863)


Added on this the change of gameplay through tiers is a pretty neat concept to cater to more players, from an arcade version with fast matches and more twitchy gameplay up to hardcore tactical play with slower ships that have a lot more options module wise. Peter noted that they felt the Corvettes are to strong against new players and to weak in the lategame, thus with the tiers they can buff them to be a suitable choice again.



The main problem with the corvettes against new players is that they dont understand how corvettes work, nor properly understand some of the basic concept of the game in general(Like shields dont block 100% of dmg unless you are a corvette, so dont wait to activate it till you are a 5% health), a proper tutorial that first cover all the basics and later even cover each individual ship type as well would alleviate a LOT of this in a much better way I think



Jawayne#8001 posted (#post-40863)


If you quit the moment this gets live, you will not change anything, you need to test it and give your feedback again and again for some time. You can of course reduce the amount of money you put into it and eveen time, but we/you lost the battle only if the game launches with it, until then the decision is open.



I will certainly try it out, but if it gonna be so obnoxious as I think, I wont be able to endure it for long



Snib#1627 posted (#post-40874)


It's a bit naive to think that feedback could change anything about this, it's too costly to develop (both in time and money) to do a 180° after you implemented it unless your player numbers tank and you have no choice.



I dont think most ppl have much against the tech trees themselves, if they just reworked it so that none of the ships are statically better than others, but only different (differnet guns, differnet amount of speed/armor (like the ships we have right now), so only the tiering itself they would have to scrap really



Snib#1627 posted (#post-40874)


In a way they've changed the target demographic though, many of the people who liked this game because of its horizontal progression will be out, remains to be seen who comes in.



Definitely agree with that