SkyRaider#3584 posted (#post-233820) said:

Not really sure how I went against my own quote? They have to make money so theres a balance. Whether they have the balance right is another question entirely.

Im with you in that I dont spend money elite. Its not my price point but for other players it is. You cant cater to all so they have to find a median. Again, whether they have that right or not is another question. I'll tell you no, but maybe Belial will tell you yes. Who is right? It really boils down to the individual.

I mean, Im not sure how to really retain people beyong suggestions Ive given. Sometimes devs listen, sometimes they dont. Greybox may not listen at all. Something should be done the way they lose players, that much we can agree on.

Yeah, figured we were on the same page with the friendly reminder sometimes things just come over tone deaf on the internet :p

Your original quote was about how you can complete the game without paying, followed by people wanting things quick and easy, you then say the grind sucks. But if you think the grind is valid because the game can be completed for free, then how can you say it sucks; you just explained it was there for a reason and you agree with the reason. Most people will not think something sucks if there is a valid reason for it being. That is how I believe you went against your own quote.

My point is people don't necessarily want things quick and easy, but rather they want to feel they are making progress and are presented with a fair challenge. There is no 'easy' in a game based on winning or losing, you have to accept you will lose to a better opponent at some point. But if you see yourself progressing to a point where you have your optimum load out in a tier V ship then you will know you are on an equal footing. Then it is down to you, your team and how you feel.

You accept you may be at a disadvantage as you climb the tiers, but the game awards your progress. It all comes down to if you think the pace of progress is good enough; that will always be down to the individual.

In any other game the difference between a new low tier and an optimum high tier in this game would have players calling OP on the high tier ship. Unfortunately I know this game does not have the numbers to rectify this by creating more than the 3 fleet choices; I know this because rather than change the issue, Dreadnought have merely juggled the tiers within the Recruit/Veteran/Legendary fleets.

If the one thing we can agree on is the game needs to stop losing players then I'm fine with that, as that has been my hope. Because without players this game will die.

Brother Belial#4215 posted (#post-233823) said:

An FYI Waverider, legendary is quite active all the time now. I never have a problem to find a match after 11am GMT.

The time is 2150hrs, I logged on and asked how Legendary was tonight, within 15 secs the first reply was from Ghost_Strain. He said:

HAHAHA!

I rest my case. O7

The chat room was #160 if you want to check quick.

WaveRider#4219 posted (#post-233826) said:

SkyRaider#3584 posted (#post-233820) said:

Not really sure how I went against my own quote? They have to make money so theres a balance. Whether they have the balance right is another question entirely.

Im with you in that I dont spend money elite. Its not my price point but for other players it is. You cant cater to all so they have to find a median. Again, whether they have that right or not is another question. I'll tell you no, but maybe Belial will tell you yes. Who is right? It really boils down to the individual.

I mean, Im not sure how to really retain people beyong suggestions Ive given. Sometimes devs listen, sometimes they dont. Greybox may not listen at all. Something should be done the way they lose players, that much we can agree on.

Yeah, figured we were on the same page with the friendly reminder sometimes things just come over tone deaf on the internet :p

Your original quote was about how you can complete the game without paying, followed by people wanting things quick and easy, you then say the grind sucks. But if you think the grind is valid because the game can be completed for free, then how can you say it sucks; you just explained it was there for a reason and you agree with the reason. Most people will not think something sucks if there is a valid reason for it being. That is how I believe you went against your own quote.

My point is people don't necessarily want things quick and easy, but rather they want to feel they are making progress and are presented with a fair challenge. There is no 'easy' in a game based on winning or losing, you have to accept you will lose to a better opponent at some point. But if you see yourself progressing to a point where you have your optimum load out in a tier V ship then you will know you are on an equal footing. Then it is down to you, your team and how you feel.

You accept you may be at a disadvantage as you climb the tiers, but the game awards your progress. It all comes down to if you think the pace of progress is good enough; that will always be down to the individual.

In any other game the difference between a new low tier and an optimum high tier in this game would have players calling OP on the high tier ship. Unfortunately I know this game does not have the numbers to rectify this by creating more than the 3 fleet choices; I know this because rather than change the issue, Dreadnought have merely juggled the tiers within the Recruit/Veteran/Legendary fleets.

If the one thing we can agree on is the game needs to stop losing players then I'm fine with that, as that has been my hope. Because without players this game will die.

Ah, ok. Well the balance is the business side, but while I dont like it I understand it. Understanding doesnt mean one agrees or likes it. I dont like the grind, many dont, but that doesnt mean I dont understand why they do it. They need to make money, but I dont like how they try and force elite to do it with a big grind.

I can agree with the making progress. I know there are a lot of players frustrated they dont do well then end up with little xp and creds. Its frustrating.

Yeah, the gap between T3 and T4 is too big imo. People get to veteran then are trounced by T4s piloted by vets with OBs and better modules. Its why Ive been saying T3s need a stat boost or more OBs need to be available at that level. Veteran is when people atart to flee.

SkyRaider#3584 posted (#post-233829) said:

WaveRider#4219 posted (#post-233826) said:

SkyRaider#3584 posted (#post-233820) said:

Not really sure how I went against my own quote? They have to make money so theres a balance. Whether they have the balance right is another question entirely.

Im with you in that I dont spend money elite. Its not my price point but for other players it is. You cant cater to all so they have to find a median. Again, whether they have that right or not is another question. I'll tell you no, but maybe Belial will tell you yes. Who is right? It really boils down to the individual.

I mean, Im not sure how to really retain people beyong suggestions Ive given. Sometimes devs listen, sometimes they dont. Greybox may not listen at all. Something should be done the way they lose players, that much we can agree on.

Yeah, figured we were on the same page with the friendly reminder sometimes things just come over tone deaf on the internet :p

Your original quote was about how you can complete the game without paying, followed by people wanting things quick and easy, you then say the grind sucks. But if you think the grind is valid because the game can be completed for free, then how can you say it sucks; you just explained it was there for a reason and you agree with the reason. Most people will not think something sucks if there is a valid reason for it being. That is how I believe you went against your own quote.

My point is people don't necessarily want things quick and easy, but rather they want to feel they are making progress and are presented with a fair challenge. There is no 'easy' in a game based on winning or losing, you have to accept you will lose to a better opponent at some point. But if you see yourself progressing to a point where you have your optimum load out in a tier V ship then you will know you are on an equal footing. Then it is down to you, your team and how you feel.

You accept you may be at a disadvantage as you climb the tiers, but the game awards your progress. It all comes down to if you think the pace of progress is good enough; that will always be down to the individual.

In any other game the difference between a new low tier and an optimum high tier in this game would have players calling OP on the high tier ship. Unfortunately I know this game does not have the numbers to rectify this by creating more than the 3 fleet choices; I know this because rather than change the issue, Dreadnought have merely juggled the tiers within the Recruit/Veteran/Legendary fleets.

If the one thing we can agree on is the game needs to stop losing players then I'm fine with that, as that has been my hope. Because without players this game will die.

Ah, ok. Well the balance is the business side, but while I dont like it I understand it. Understanding doesnt mean one agrees or likes it. I dont like the grind, many dont, but that doesnt mean I dont understand why they do it. They need to make money, but I dont like how they try and force elite to do it with a big grind.

I can agree with the making progress. I know there are a lot of players frustrated they dont do well then end up with little xp and creds. Its frustrating.

Yeah, the gap between T3 and T4 is too big imo. People get to veteran then are trounced by T4s piloted by vets with OBs and better modules. Its why Ive been saying T3s need a stat boost or more OBs need to be available at that level. Veteran is when people atart to flee.

Ahhh, ok. You don't like something, think it sucks, understand the game is losing people, but accept why they do it nonetheless? I can't quite get my head around the logic of that, but I know some of it will probably be down to you hoping something will help this game (so not wanting to be as negative as I am being), and some of it is probably me just not understanding well enough.

It's your comment about 'understanding it is a business thing'. If you openly admit they need to do something to stop losing people, what they are doing isn't working (otherwise they would be doing better) and they need to make money, yet their business approach is not doing that - how can you understand that?

My view is you don't make money by making people believe their time is being wasted. You take them on a journey, you know 'Around the World in 80 days', just don't end up making one of those days a Groundhog Day where you seem to go nowhere. O7

id say there needs to be more retrofits in the marketplace for every ship. would love some better cosmetic options or still add a prestige option for rhe ranks to award cosmetics by only leveling those ranks up( different colored beams,smoke trails, thrusters, etc)